some questions and thoughts i have about origin of rats in NIHM universe

edited December 2014 in General Discussion

i take my wood and carrying him to forest.... yes i realize that this theme was on this forum, old forum and in many fanfic 1000 times... in a 1000 ways. but i do it...

We know that intelligence of rats was caused in laboratories of NIMH... but here is question... WHY... why these scientist do that?

And i try put my answer... no my answer, no.... only deduction...

Notice: I dont read any fanfiction and i not finish book yet.... also i do not found topics in forum what touch this theme

Sins of cold war

By book and arange of Bluth's film everithing beggin sometimes in 60th +/- in United States and what we have in that age.... expect vietnam war, hippies?... we are deeply in cold war... and this was age when both sides (capitalism west and comunism east) finding ways how piss others side to back... and everything what can able do that was worthable... even if that was potencialy crazy, or globaly dangerous (remeber on project Starfish Prime).

Is not hard thought about what do biologist, medicians, and psychonalaitics in their laboratories... at least is many stories and documents about it... But still stay question why.

And here is put my deduction... some project what trying enrise mind abilites of humans, hence army... intelligence, and/or, if we be more conspirative comics... exstrasensory perceptions and abilites... and they found ways how to do that.... and ofcourse in first line of experiments on live organism was rats and mice...

What about NIMH, if this was think what higthly probably lead some what like CIA... becouse NIMH work with it... mental health is their proffesions.... and these complexes oftenly colaborate with similiars authorites as CIA...

But what we know.... within rodents was this very succesfull... but not any peoples, such as soldiers or superagents not bother Soviet union... why?... something must was wrong...

firstly i turn on moment to somehow diferent problem: We know that these changes on rodents are hereditary... so some experiments with ading better cells to brains (what i read recently) not work for next posibly generations, becouse this „addon“ is not part of genetic information...

So this what they do with rodents must change their genom.... if we realize that was happen in sometime 60th so some targeted changes of genetic information is hardly imaginate, becouse genetics was in that age really new and not much understand discipline... (how looks genetic spiral they know only few yers... but no much know what it actualy does... and it they dont know until today... remember on „Junk DNA“)

So i gues... yep it is still somehow wild like nuclear spider bitting Peter Parker and we have Spiderman... but is thought.... NIMH specialist make something probably accidentally „virus“... more precisely „Vector Retrovirus“! These kind of virus change genetic information of every cell what they infected... what i know... and this doesent much (im not virologist) but what i read somewhere... so by example of Peter Parker's spider this can change DNA to much that can make rodents what we know from books and movie... :) if we accept that this vector retrovirus is special... baken in laboratories was never exist by top secret scientist... mwhahaha

Yes is somehow wild, but i dont have nothing better.... so allow me, a while stay on this theory...

if we accept that change of rodents is caused of this virus will make anither question... „virulency“ if is casued of virus, thats mean this is really possibly contagious... now how is this can be contagius? For better recessing into universum i guess rhat virus vilby contgius by contact (like rabies). So by spittle, blood and another body fluids...

but this make one more question.... what happen if subject A infected by this virus, at example, bite subject B and now we must also ask, if subject B is another rat (if we teel that subject A is also rat) or anodher kind of animal, hence man.

Yes thisis wilder row by row.... i know.... but let me still staying on it... we suppose, that virus mutate somehow self when mutating infected organism and cause, that is contagius to next over subject only on another subject of same kind... so if infected norwegain rat bites another rat, that bitten rat after incubation time starts mutate into supersmart kind, but if bite some different kind, rat moduled virus cant introduce to cells of different kind and die... so rat can make smart only another rat, mouse can make smart only anothre mouse, etcetera...

universal inefctious is only „primodial sample“ of virus... primodial sample can infected every live organism and change it.... question will be to what turn what kind....

however we stay still by rodent now... yes now what i type earliner sounds probably weird... but however, whether it's weird how he wants.... help us fill some questions in original story

at example:

Field mouse, who could read

I know original story is child novel and these stuff there too do not solving... but ill ask... respective i notice.... if although I admit that mice are not stupid.... but are not too clever that they are not capable of learning to read, let alone learn it... so, reading of text is relative complex think.... (i must again mention, im not leraned in taht thinks... so i apologize for some bollocks, ill just say what i think) when u learn reading... u must memorize symbols and/or combinations of symbols and mainly be able assign raight meaning to symbols/words.... assign tu full meaning sentence and understand meaning of message of this text... at example computers they can read text.... but they not able understand meaning of message.... u can ask to computer „why is sun red, if is close to horizon“ computer dont answer.... jsut také every single word and this combination and compare with sentenses on internet (ok, computer with internet) and offer you best match... klingon, or english.... computer dont care... he dont understand nothing.... in mice case i afraid but they not able learn to read... let alone know how to read... so Mrs. Brisby / Mrs. Frisby, who is teached by Jonathan and be able making oftenly complicated logical decision, cannot by ordinery field mouse... so here is two possibilites...

Firstly: either she was also in laboratories of NIMH and she for some reason dont remember it (but this is colide with canon information that survive only two mice – Jonathan and Mr. Aages) or she born to parents who were part of NIMH and escape earliner and they do not say her about it... and dont mad on me this seem to me really wild...

Secondly: she, or her parent come to contact with Jonathan or Mr. Aeges fluids and was infected... i can realize that Mrs. Brisby as ordinery field mouse just protect her teritory againist strange male, which she sees in Jonathan and by protecting gnawed him... and virus after time turn her to smart one... soonly they falling into love... et cetera... you know...

Another advantage of virulence of this vector retrovirus is that can explain and allow put much more superinteligent rats than origin (if i remember right) 40 rats and two mice.... they come from some battles where was contact with infected fluids... of course this made two more question

first: why they dont notice earliner? I try answr by „incubation time“.... we say-.... at example.... three days.... from point of view of inteligent rat this will look as they was attacked by sevage rat.... inteligent surviver.... defend self.... and rat from lost battle run away... and all is okey... inteligent one just heal his wound and go by his way... from point of view of ordinery rat this mean three days of normal life.... and after he beggin change...

Second question: doesent it mean that will be now superinteligent rats and mice everywhere? No needly... Firstly similiar battles are not much often in nature by self... in rat behavior true that if they experience a different odor foreign group of rat that is stronger, they will not come to his teritory... and also is here another element:

Time of transformation... changing from ordinery one to supersmart one doesent happen withi second... transformation probably také time and more... transformation can be probably very intensive on source of energy and... damn dont know right word... materials... architecture of your biology will be very changed.... u will have terrible thirst and hunger.... probably with focus on proteins... u will be very teared... i will feel pain... and this can také we say a whole week... until change will be completelly... in laboratories this transform is relativy easy all sources u have close and if u are not able take them laboratory technician inject them into you... If this happen to you in wild.... u are very probably screwed... as prey animal without ability starve more than 3 days + how faster now body burn his sources.... if i say that only 10% of infected subjects will survive it im probably optimist...

(if you ask what do virus with predators who killed infected subject.... what i said earliner only primodila virus can infect everything... if already changed on subject from on kind can be contagius only in kind of subject... so only in case of cannibalism virus may spread further :) )

either way spreading of this virus will be slover than can be awaited....

infectiousness of next generations

One more question.... if is here virus.... how will be contagius in next generation? Can offspring of infected subject infect natural same kind? Or will be virus in next generations inactive?

Of course here is one problem... that is do not througthable for me...

Others... what with them?

Jeremy, Great Owl, Auntoie Shrew and probably more... diferent kinds of animals.... and they are inteligent... for him will not eligible for the strength of the virus... Yes I Know... Novel originaly for children not solve these questions... just making story and deep logic of global causality of universe let it go... let it go... Can't hold it back anymore... yep... with Shrew at example can be solved by that that shee is mouse, but looks like shrew... and Owl... hmmm in example of movie can be explained by mind control of Nicodemos along the lines of Dr. Xavier... (at least Owl and Nicodemus are voiced acted by same actor isnt it? :D ) about Jeremy... i dont reeally know.... yep what i now typed is really weak and dull.... this is like glue two metal parts together wit fast glue.... on moment it will hold... on moment...

so i dont know what to do with others....

This is probably only problem for me.... its ok... i understand.... but i work with main idea that if all animals have inteligence similliar as human... so our current civilization cannot look like looks.... becouse these animals rise againist us very long time ago...

this is becouse i making these thing game, hypothesys and deduction about his origin, what others animals totally ruin... So you said what u thing...

i will continue in debate themes... now is here appereance seeable and hiden.... probably seems irelevant... but i guess tat have big importance, becouse this make his really behave and looks:

p.s. Really sorry for my english, i hope thats is enought understandable and will be least misunderstanding.

Comments

  • Your idea is very similar to my own story in that it involves government using a virus to make "super soldiers". I haven't revealed this yet in my own story...but we seem to have an agreement there.

  • is just result of the possibilities that it could cause... but is question hoow this virus could exactly work...

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